When you sell electric bikes and electric motorcycles like we do, you get asked a lot of different questions.  Are they waterproof?  Can it carry me and my dog?  Why don't they just make them all electric?  

But the one question that really stands out centers around, the center of these devices, the battery packs.  Without the battery packs these vehicles wouldn't go.  Well, some of the E-bikes you can still pedal, but you know what I mean.  The packs are essential and generally heavy.  The weight is all relative depending on the unit, but no matter how small or large, your battery pack is going to be a significant part of your E-bike or E-Motorcycle's overall weight.  As a general "rule of thumb" you could think of battery weight of current technology being:

1AH = 1Lb

This isn't always true, some batteries will weigh more and some will weigh less, but in general you can consider current Li-Ion technology will give you 1 Amp Hour of power per 1 pound of weight.  Again, this isn't a accurate measurement, but one meant to help the consumer better understand the specifics around their battery.  And this is going to be very important as we get to the actual question people ask about these battery packs.  That's right, we haven't addressed that yet, but you might have an idea of where I'm going with this already.

When it comes to an E-bike, the battery pack can be small or large.  Heavy or light, it all depends on how many cells it has in it.  For most of the E-bikes on the market the battery pack is easily removeable.  If you run your battery down and want to put on another one, go ahead.  If you want to take the battery inside to charge, go for it.  This is because most E-Bike batteries don't weigh more 20lbs making it easy for your average person to remove and carry inside.

With some of the electric motorcycles that have been introduced into the market, there have been promises of a light, removeable battery that could get you around all day.  So far, it's really been one or another, but not both.  This is because of what we discussed above and the power consumption of an electric motorcycle versus an electric bike.

Now the big question we get: 

*Drumroll please*

"Are the batteries in the electric motorcycle removeable?"

That's it, that's the one.  To most of you, it seems obvious, of course you can remove the battery, just like an E-bike.  But when you start adding up the AH and what that means for your driving distance and weight, you'll see these aren't the same machines.  

To begin with, an E-bike is heavy compared to a regular bike, but they generally weigh less than 100lbs.  Most electric motorcycles use heavier DOT approved parts and weigh 200+lbs curb weight.  It's going to take more motor and more battery to get an electric motorcycle going than an electric bike.  You could use the same 20AH/20lb battery packs you would find on an E-bike, but you probably won't be happy with your e-motorcycles performance or range.  Instead, manufacturers have built bigger batteries with more AH to allow your e-motorcycle to perform they way you might expect.  To go fast, get to a certain top speed and be able to go a certain range on a single charge.  In order to achieve the trifecta balance, you need a big battery pack.  On the smaller side of range, we see e-motorcycles with 40AH battery packs.  These units have a general range of 30+miles.  Not bad, but as we increase performance, we increase power consumption, so we increase battery AH capacity to compensate.  This means the battery packs for e-motorcycles are getting into the 80AH and 100+AH ranges.  These battery packs are necessary for proper performance, but weigh almost 100lbs on their own.  It's like your battery pack is a whole E-bike worth of weight!

Those numbers make it a chore to remove your e-motorcycle battery to take inside to charge.  It also means you could really hurt yourself if you tried.  No steel toes, dropped the edge of the pack on your foot, ouch!  The point is that when it comes to getting an electric motorcycle that will have any real performance and range, you're not going to be able to take out the battery pack.  There's also another thing to think about when it comes to taking the batteries out of your electric motorcycle, the alarm will stop working.  Which might not be so bad, you already have the most expensive part in your house.  The thieves will get a shell, but you'll still be left without a ride.

There have been quite a few people that have called and asked, "Can you take the battery out of that?".  It may seem to make sense, depending on your situation, but when it comes to the electric motorcycle itself and your enjoyment of it, being able to take the battery out is truly a pain you don't need.

When City Planners and Politicians look at future planning and budgets they have lots of hard decisions to make.  The first being supporting existing infrastructure or working on new ones.  This is what I call the "E-Bike Political Paradox".  People need the existing car oriented infrastructure to continue to work and grow so they can also work and grow.  At the same time, officials are faced with the needs of the future.  They need to see ahead for their constituents and beyond.  

There have been many inflection points in American Society.  The choice to embrace the automobile allowed for expansive growth across the entirety of our Country.  For Good and Bad, it has allowed us to become what we are today.  Even that deeply incumbent set of businesses is going through their own rebuilding today.  Competing with the future, in Tesla and other new manufacturers here and overseas.  With the future being Electrification of mobility, Planners and Officials need to consider a more holistic view of the city, its future and direction of Growth.  

Many Governments, local and federal, have offered and considered rebates to allow many more to access the future as early as possible.  These rebates have centered around the auto industry, but more recently citizens and officials alike have come to recognize the E-Bike and E-Motorcycle as highly efficient and fun ways to provide mobility to their lives.  In our customer and citizen interactions we've found that pricing is somewhat a concern.  With the number one concern being road safety.  Especially in the E-bike potential and current commuter base.   

With so many different concerns of current and future mobility infrastructure, Planners and Officials are placed in the most difficult situations of decision making.  How do they allocate their funds appropriately to make the greatest impacts for today while keeping them moving towards the future.

Rebates are Great, but for Who?

Ok, so little bit of political mass population operations theory here.  The Carrot, the Stick, the Sermon and now The Nudge.  These are all things used by governments to encourage large populations to embrace change.  Rebates are generally viewed as "Carrots".  In today's environment you could call filling your gas tank "the Stick", ouch!  We've all heard "The Sermon", "It's the War, you have to pay more."  And before you go any farther with that, please, take it to Twitter, not about the politics here.  Then there's the Nudge.  I prefer this method, it's like Mom hitting you with the guilty reminder of what you should be doing.  Eventually, you hear the voice in your head and take the appropriate action.  How much any one or mixture of those works depends on individual psychologies.  Applied across the whole, you can create the greatest amount of behavioral change.  

Rebates are generally viewed as temporary.  This is because they only encourage on part of the overall required behavioral changes.  The idea being if you got one, you'll use it.  At the same time, the rebate creates a psychology of decreased value.  Since someone was able to get something for so much less than what it would normal be in an open market environment it creates a false view of lower value.  This is a large reason why I'm not the biggest fan of rebates provided by governments.  If the rebate is a direct financial provision of the manufacturer, that makes more sense to me.  This creates a direct understanding that the manufacturer is doing this to gain market share and the pricing will be higher.  Think crowd sourcing campaigns.  You get a discounted price for buying something early, that's basically a manufacturers rebate at point of sale.  

"Why should the manufacturer offer a rebate, John?  Makes no sense to me." 

I feel the same way about government rebates.  It's basically paying yourself back for buying something you might not of in the first place.  It tells me you might have had somewhere better for that money to go.  Of course E-bike manufacturers and retailers support it, it means you'll artificially come buy more product from them.  Then they can go to more investors and say, "See, people want there, we need more money."  Again, it's artificial.  And you might think as a PEV Marketplace we'd want this.  Besides, our E-motorcycles fall right inline with most the requirements of the rebates being offered or considered.  Makes some of them only a few hundred dollars some places.  

But we want a real market.  One that isn't spending government subsidies to over charging brands disguised as "rebates".  

We Took a Totally Different Approach

There's lots of companies out there that aren't going to like what I'm saying here.  And they're really not going to like it if Government Officials read and understand this too.  But here it is:

Government Rebates for Ebikes only Help Ebike Companies

There, it's out there, I said it and I'm sure many agree and disagree.  It may have helped you buy an ebike from a company that really could've sold it to you for less and still made a profit.  That's been our approach from the beginning.  We're not looking for hand outs from the Government and essentially the People of the USA, but rather their Honest Purchase from us and into the Electric Future.  We reduce prices to bring you comparable units while still making a reasonable profit.  We could charge more.  After all, the goal of a company is to make profits.  But for us, before profit, comes happy customers, who got great deals and love the way these things can change their lives.

We can do this without adding excessive overhead.  Those are the top 2 goals of a business, happy customers and efficient operations.  Profit will cascade from there.

Our Request for Officials

We are all for rebates and if already offered in your area it doesn't make any sense to pull them back.  What we would ask is that there be more focus on the infrastructure and spending.  As a business owner that offers many of the same models for less, I know that part can be done from our end.  Regardless of our own friendly competition, making them more accessible to everyone should be our collective goal as businesses.  From your end as an Official, People Centric planning for safer roadways that encourage bicycle, E-bike and E-motorcycle traffic.  There are many multi-decade and multi-generational examples in European cities that can be easily adopted and added here.   

Las Vegas, being a newer city and mostly a grid layout lends itself well to this type of future planning.  It's 215 loop provides outside quadrant access to the interior of the city.  While the cross of the 15 and 95 can allow for more direct access, for cars.  Interior areas get slowed down for safer travel.  The decreasing of reaction time/speed ratios by drivers will lead to decreased accidents and deaths.  An interesting side effect of slowed traffic and traffic on bike/e-bikes, local businesses and neighborhood thrive and become deeper communities.  Again, there are many examples of this in Europe going back to the 70's showing impact and yield over decades.  With the city layout Las Vegas has, the addition of more tunnels under the Strip, we think Las Vegas could lead the way in this planning and design.

Our Request of Riders and Citizens

No one is going to argue that our roads could be safer in general.  After the recent pandemic traffic fatalities have skyrocketed.  If you agree, and you would like to feel safe riding a bicycle/ebike/emotorcycle, please contact your local City, County, State politicians.  Let them know what you've told me.  I ride almost daily and multiple times each ride I avoid a collision.  Once in a while it's even my mistake.  No one's perfect, but overwhelmingly, I'm dodging someone in a car not looking or not caring.  Tell, them about your experience too.  Tell them you want safer streets to ride on.  Tell them that if they were safer you'd save money and have a better quality of life.  That your mobility shouldn't be oppressed by the high cost of fuel, but lifted up by the abundance of Electricity!

    Probably the single most asked question I get besides, do you have a discount code, is,  "Are you just a drop shipper?" I know it's meant as a way for the customer to understand our place in the process, but there always seems to be this under lying tone of, "That means they're not in your hands."  Which you would be correct.  There's also a tone of, "What kind of Drop Shipper are you?" Not all companies that use drop shipping are created equal and we'll  get into that too.

Let's Start with that....

    Let's start with the different types of companies you may encounter that use drop shipping.  It might surprise you that some of the largest corporations in the world use drop shipping.  They have someone make it for them, then someone else handles all the logistics.  There's a company that is worth over a trillion dollars that does that for lots of companies, the Big "A".  That is the core of their "Seller Model".  Not one of my favorites, but you can't deny the fact they do very well as a drop shipper.

    Now there's other companies, usually smaller ones, where the person or people will just pass-thru list an item for a company.  They act more like a sales rep and payment processor.   If you need support or to return something, you'll need to talk with the company.  They would be the other end of the spectrum from the Big "A".

    And then there's companies like ours.  We're in the middle.  We provide listings, support, sales, services.  We don't go as far as the Big "A" in telling our manufacturers how to operate, and we don't tell you to go talk with the manufacturer when you need support.  We ride in that middle ground, providing you help when you need it and supporting our manufacturers in their efforts to provide you with quality products at reasonable prices.

    When you think about if a company  uses drop shipping, remember, it's not about how they get it to you, it's about how they treat you after you got it.

Drop Shipping is Better you say?  Do, go on with your bad self...

    When we started putting E-powersport together we took a long analytical look at the processes involved.  This includes how we store and ship items.  All items, we have so many more coming.  We had some very interesting shipping experiences of our own.  We decided the best way to make sure you get a fully functioning E-bike is to send it freight or Carrier as little as possible.  Or what I like to call, "The LCD Shipping Consideration".  If you've ever shipped an LCD, they're horrible.  80% of the time it's fine, the other 20% totaled.  This is why they tell you to keep the box and all the foam packaging.  Every time you move an LCD you risk breaking it.  This is what we saw with even the heaviest boxed Ebikes.  Double walled would even see rip throughs and in2out punctures.  

    Now you're thinking, that makes no sense, I move the thing all over when riding it.  I take it to the mountains, desert, the coffee shop, etc.  Yes, but it's your E-bike.  All the shipper knows is it's another heavy, awkward box in their truck.  And if you didn't you should've gotten the insurance!  LOL!  Seriously, even though they try, the shipper can only control so much.  There's lots of other boxes, pallets, big things that need to be strapped down and moved with 4 pallet jacks and oops, ripped the box.  

    That's why we decided whenever possible we'll use drop shipping.  If it's cost effectivity no longer provides the same value add we see in reducing the overall shipping and handling issues, then we'll look to do different.  At current, it provides the best experience for our customers, allows us to have reduced costs passing savings on to you and focus our efforts on making sure we're bringing you products that have a very high value to cost ratio.

Responsibility and Sustainability

One of the other big reasons to use Drop Shipping is Corporate Responsibility and Sustainability.  Which is something we're all about, so it makes sense we'd use the method that requires less fuel, less infrastructure use and less creation of pollutants.  As we grow, we'll continue to look at new ways to expand on this vision.  Once we can get things delivered by an Electric Semi Truck it's happening.  When it comes to being a sustainability focused company, it only makes sense to reduce all the things we're working against, by also reducing the amount of impact your exciting new e-bike has in getting to you.  By those numbers if an e-bike company isn't using Drop Shipping, are they really living up to the collective mission?

    There's nothing wrong with drop shipping products.  Sometimes it's actually the best way to go.  It's about how  they treat you once the sale is done that matters most.  

Before I started E-Powersport.com, to help people get affordable electric transportation, I was a Tech Recruiter.  For over 20 years I operated counter to the normal operations of most recruiters.  I'm honest, up front and tell you straight how it is at the company.  Over the years and many successful placements, I earned a reputation as one of the few recruiters in the industry that operates with exceptional Integrity.

And perhaps that's what drew me to Electric Transportation.  As I looked across the landscape, I saw very little integrity.  I'm not just talking about these, "charge you $2k and never talk to you again" companies.  That's just become the norm.  I'm talking about the most of the media that covers it.

There was a time, before Internet, where what you read in a newspaper or magazine was validated multiple times.  Where you couldn't pay for a story or review of a product, but had to get honest and truly informative stories out there.  As our media has grown, we've seen the advent of "fake news", "false stories" and advertising based media assets.  When you start looking at Electric Vehicle news it can be hard to distinguish the honest actors from the paid shills.  And there's a lot of them.

Many of the media spaces I thought were doing it for the story, have shown to me since starting this, they're in it for the payday.  Not the candy bar but the Monetary Support of the companies for which they review.  Great example, one of the Kollter dealers paid a major EV review website, $10K to review the Kollter ES-1.  Interesting that we never saw it hit 75mph as claimed.  Because it can't.  It's interesting that the reviewer doesn't actually dig into the Kollter as you might expect, but instead, gives it glowing commentary.  And you can find this same format across most of their stories.  I found myself asking, "Wow, how much do they charge for these factory tours.  Must be like a $20K fee or something."

Now, don't start to think that it's just that one group that get paid to tell you how wonderful, mediocre E-bikes and EVs are, but many more out there do the same.  The big problem is that none of them are acting in YOUR best interests.  They're acting in their own, by taking the money and the interests of their financial backers.  This is the same with many of the YouTube reviews you'll see.  Like, why is a woman who likes to fish in a bikini telling you about how great this Ebike is that some "branded" Ebike company sent her?  She knows absolutely nothing about them and you're all just watching her because she's fishing in a bikini.  If it helps sell them to you and instill a sense of integrity for you, I will do a YouTube video in a bikini with our E-bikes.  Not going to look near as good, but you'll get how serious I am about this issue.  

"But, John, you sell Ebikes and e-Motorcycles aren't you going to tell us how good they are so we buy them from you?"

Yes and No.  If you saw our Kollter ES-1 disassembly video you know that we may sell it to you, but still want you to know and be happy with your purchase.  Even at the cost of our dealership license, we gave you the straight dope on those units.  And, for everything we sell, we will continue to do so.  I say, what we sell, because I've already made a short clip to explain how we Will Not, review units we're not selling.  We see that as an unethical approach for a Retail business.  Every time I see other dealers reviewing units they don't sell the summation ends with, "We wouldn't sell this for reasons XXX, but you can buy our more expensive unit that we prefer."  Well of course you prefer it, you sell it!  We see this as a conflict of interest.  

"Who, oh who will think of the consumer!?"

Just as we've found many a questionable actor in this media section of the industry we have also found those that are honest and operate with integrity.  Similar to recruiting, they are few and far between.  These teams operate for the story.  It keeps them from having any unconscious bias for or against the product.  Some may take a fee for their time, but the reviews stand based on the experience.

Some of these are:

Anything Action Magazine - When we've had discussions with editors from this group of media assets, we found they are truly interested in the story and wouldn't even think of taking a Reviewer's Fee.  That is the true identifier of Honest Media.

The Inja on YouTube- This team has produced some amazing materials.  Not just in the review category, but also in the DIY EV category.  Best part about them, as a company they will take your money, but the review is the review.  If your product sucks, it sucks, if it rocks, it rocks.  But they don't create Reviewer Fluff.  

SurRonster on YouTube - He does mostly riding videos with his crew, but still has some great review and assembly/DIY category stuff.  So far, I haven't seen him shill on anything.  Plus, when I offered to pay him for a review, he declined.  He showed and we discussed how he's more interested in the content and creation than getting a payday.  Made props and respect out to that him!

We've also started the production of a truly non-biased set of tools to help you make the most informed decision when making your electric purchase.  We have our Ebike Buyers' Comparison tool.  This is an always updating tool, that has some very exciting developments coming.  You can compare some of the top brands in the industry to the units we carry and their own.  This is a great objective tool to help you make sure you're getting the best overall value for your dollar.  Not just promises of a good time.  We already have more tools to implement that will work together to help you make sure you're making not just the best purchase, but the best purchase for you.

     It doesn't take long for someone looking to buy a new E-bike to quickly realize that these machines boast great distances per charge!  They are amazing and why would you ever step in a car again?!?!  Well, there's a common downside to those wonderfully high 40/60/80/100+ mile per charge rating from most companies...... they're NOT REAL!  That's right, that's what I said, they are at best a guesstimated calculation to present a favorable number to you.  Because who wants to spend $1500+ on transportation that won't even get you down the street let alone across town.  But we at E-powersport.com don't believe in over inflating our numbers, much to the happiness of our investors too.  

       In the rest of this Blog Article we'll discuss how you, yes you, maybe even you, but I'm not so sure about that guy, can easily tell how much distance you can realistically expect.  There is some basic math involved and we're going to look at it from 2 different number calculations, but in the end, you'll be able to confidently go into any bike shop and tell them the realistic #s and if they're full of shit or not.  Which is your right as a consumer and potential customer.

First, let's explain why companies label their E-bikes with such high numbers as to lead you to disappointment.  I'm going to be a little absurd here, but you'll get the point.  When other E-bike companies test an E-bike's distance capability, they first go through the company and poll their staff to see who has the smallest and lightest 13 year old.  Thirteen as that's about grown up enough to handle a motorized vehicle.  This 98lb Tween is then told they will get a pony or go-cart if they pedal the E-bike on level 2 until their little legs fall off.  Sometimes they get to take a break to use the bathroom, but normally they make them wait till the battery runs out.  Luckily, the components are waterproof incase of an accident.  They then chase the child with small dogs to help keep them pedaling and when done, they round up to the nearest Tens place, yielding those wonderfully high milage numbers we're all used to seeing.  

*This is an absurd joke to demonstrate the absurdity of what is actually done in testing*

     Now, I don't know about you, but the last time I weighed 98lbs I was 10 years old.  Yeah, I was, still kind of am, the chubby kid.  Which works for you, since we rate our units on being able to move my 210lbs around.  So, when you see a distance rating on our website, you know some chunky guy was able to get 60+ miles out of it and your waifiness should be able to go a bit farther.  All that is great when it comes to buying from us, but what if you did the dirty deed and bought from someone else.  Well, I can't fault you for it, not everyone knows about us yet.  But here's how you can do a little math and make sure you know, for sure, what you're buying vs. what's being said on the marketing flyer:

To give things more context, let's look at a competitor's E-bike, the Himiway Zebra.  Himiway claims that it's 750w motor and 960wh battery will get you 80+ miles per charge.  Poppycock!  Maybe with Bob's kid riding it with those dogs at his feet, but not my fat butt.  Let's break it down and see what you can really expect.

The motor is 750w.  That means at full speed, it runs 750w average per hour.  The wattage per hour for the battery is 960wh.  If we divide 960/750 we get 1.28.  This means if you run the motor at full speed for an hour and 20 minutes you will have run the battery out of juice.  Since most E-bikes running at 48v stay around 28-30mph, we'll call it 28mph.  At 28mph for 1.28 hours you would travel 35.84 miles total distance per charge.

Taking the word problem out of it:

(Total Battery WH) / (Total Motor Wattage) = (Total Runtime per Charge) x (Avg MPH) = Realistic Expected Distance Per Charge

Now let's look at this from my favorite factor in this electrical burrito, the Amp.  If you read our previous blog entries you'll know that Wattage is a rating comprised of multiplying Voltage by Amps.  For me, since I already know what the Voltage rating is and voltage generally runs at a constant, if it's a 48v system, it's 48v going through it when on.  If it's 72v there's 72v and so on.  What changes is the applied Amperage.  The changing of the amperage is what allows companies to say a motor operates at one speed, while being able to "Burst" to a higher speed.  This is why I prefer to focus on Amps and amp hours.  It works the same, but for me a little cleaner as it take some of the guestimate work out of things.

Amps:

First, let me preface this by saying, not all companies disclose their amp ratings.  Most use Wattage because it's a rating most people are familiar with due to light bulbs.  

If you want to break it down, you can reverse factor by dividing the rated wattage by the voltage, in most cases 48v or 72v, but check your specs to be sure.  What you'll find is most of your E-bikes at 48v are running 12amps.  This means that at the highest point, when your riding up that big hill, the motor is drawing a maximum of 12amps charge.  Here's the funny thing, though your motor might be rated for a certain wattage, most will accept more amps and hence increase the wattage, as mentioned before, burst mode.  Now there are some, well most motors actually, where if it runs nominally at 12amps, it usually means it can range up to about 15-20amps, let's say 20amps multiplied by 48v equals 960w.  This is how and why there is a peak and a nominal rating for most E-bike motors.  Now, let's look at how this would effect distance per charge of our example unit, the Himiway Zebra.

Battery rated Capacity : 20AH

Now there's no Amp Rating, but I know it's 48v @ 750w so well, divide, 750w/48v = 15Amps

Meaning if we run at full draw of 15amps on a battery that can provide 20Amps per hour, we'll end up with 1.33 hours of runtime @28mph for a total distance of 37.24miles per charge.  

Now, that's not bad for the Himiway Zebra, considering our estimates are pure throttle usage and don't impart any human efforts applied.  But I'm still not convinced you'll get 80+miles, more like 60+ if you pedal along too, which is still a respectable DPC(distance per charge).  We prefer to use the "Scotty Principle" in our ratings.  For those that don't know, it's from Star Trek and means, we under promise and over deliver.  It's what made Mr. Scott the best Chief of Engineering Evva!

Looking at the difference between the two calculations you can see that they're relatively close, but not the same.  This is why I take the Amps calc over the Wattage.  Though Wattage is more conservative, Amps are a direct calculation without adding another variable, ie voltage.  But either way you can easily see that you're not going to get 80+ miles out of a charge on that E-bike.  

     I mean anything IS possible.  If they throw someone's Jockey sized kid on it, or maybe just hire some Jockeys.  I mean, Jockeys are literally hired based on height and weight for the exact purposes of extending the horses speed and distance.  Something for the retired Jockeys to do now!  But when it comes to E-bikes, e-Enduros, e-Motorcycles and any other electric transportation we sell, you can be assured we've tested them, we've rated them and we stand behind them.  Because if you stand in front of one you're likely to get run over!  LOL, thanks for reading!

~John 

     When it comes to most industries there's questions that get asked over and over.  Comparisons that were made before done again and again.  The E-bike industry isn't immune to these questions.  In some ways, being a newer and developing industry, it has even more than others.  The big question we're going to address today is the not so age old one of, "Is a Torque Sensor better than a Cadence Sensor for E-Bike Riding?".  And really, is it that simple?

     There's a lot of people out there that will tell you, "You should only get an E-bike with a Torque sensor."  But there's even fewer that will tell you to get one with a Cadence sensor.  I think the above response is an easy one.  To flatly say you should do something makes the overall sales and education process easier for the Sales Rep.  But, there are some valid reasons those people would say to get a torque sensor.  For example, if you have a mid-drive E-bike a torque sensor is preferred.  It will be inside the motor, close to the controller and able to provide immediate feedback to the Pedal Assist System.  Oh, wait, what?  You don't know how these sensors work with the Pedal Assist?  Let's back up a second.....

     So, the Cadence and Torque Sensors are used on E-bikes to tell the controller how much effort you're putting in and, based on the pedal assist setting, how much power to assist you with on your ride.  Let's say your cruising your E-bike with your Pedal assist set to 4.  As you pedal those sensors tell the controller you're putting in some effort.  The controller tells the motor, "Hey, looks like they're doing about 10mph, the setting says we should help them up to 18mph.  Push it to 18mph."  And the motor puts in the extra effort.  Even more "Basic" if you need it, sensor takes reading telling motor how much to help. 

     Ok, now that you know what we're talking about let's get to talking about it.  When it comes to sensors, any kind, there's something called a Sample Rate.  It's how often the sensor takes a reading.  With a Torque Sensor this is almost a constant Sample Rate, and with a Cadence sensor it depends on the number of magnets, but we'll get to that.  Generally, a Cadence sensor is going to have a much lower sample rate than a Torque sensor.  And that's OK, because even the little Cadence Sensor is strong enough, light enough and gosh darn it, it works in the right application.

Cadence Sensors

     Both sensors work by checking their measurements at the crank/pedals.  Let's dig into each of these sensors individually.  Starting with the simplest, the Cadence Sensor.  For pedal assist systems a Cadence sensor is a set of magnets in a circle, with a sensor that checks each time it passes by a magnet.  By telling the controller how many of these magnets are on the disc the controller can get a sense of how fast you're pedaling based on passing the magnets on the disc.  It's not the most accurate method.  This lack of fine accuracy means you will experience some delay and some pedaling slack.  

*Pedaling slack is what happens when you're pedaling is out of sync with the electric motor.  This normally occurs at higher speeds as it's harder for and compensate between your pedaling and speeds above 25mph.  This phenomenon isn't reserved for Cadence sensors, but we'll talk about that in a minute.*

     As far as the Cadence sensor is concerned, you need to understand, it is a ring of magnets sitting on the pedal crank.  It reads the revolutions your pedaling produces and tells the controller in a rough sense how much to put back in.  Because of this you may hear E-bikers refer to pedaling a Cadence based E-bike as "Dummy Pedaling".  You're pedaling, the action is taking place, but there's no heavy resistance.  It's telling the motor to push, but your effort contribution is less direct and more direction to the system to go.  

As an Example, you can take the chain off a Cadence based system pedal and the motor will kick in.  Pedal as fast as you can with no resistance and the motor will leap into accelerating you forward with all it's might.  

     Of course, having a chain on your E-bike makes it much easier should you run out of battery, so we don't recommend doing this unless you're chain breaks or you absolutely need to.

Torque Sensors, Better, but are They?

When you go and buy something, anything, there's always the idea in the back of your mind, "If I pay more, it's better."  I think this combined with the more finite Sample Rate, we mentioned above, give E-Bike enthusiasts and Technicians alike the ammo they need to say flatly, "A torque sensor is better than a Cadence Sensor."  And if the world and choices were so simple it might be so.  The IRL is we all have different needs, concerns and budgets.  Let's cover the first thing about a Torque sensor, they are more expensive.  

For example, if you need to replace your Torque sensor it's quite a bit of work, taking up to 2-3 shop hours in total.  The part itself is also 10+x more expensive than a top Cadence sensor.  If you have a limited maintenance budget for your E-bike purchase one with a Torque Sensor may be nice, but may not be your best option for cost effective maintenance.   Altogether, completed shop repair, you can expect to pay $400-$500 to replace a torque sensor.  The good news is they don't fail very often.  So why are they so much more expensive?  The sensors used and the full crankshaft build means lots of specifications to fit.  It means lots of little internal parts.  If you remember from above, a Cadence sensor is some magnets on a disc and another disc that spins and reads how many times it passes.  With a Torque sensor it's translating the force you use to push down on the pedals into a number the controller can understand.  The controller then does the same thing it would do with the Cadence Sensor, it tells the motor how much effort to put in.  

Torque Sensors are really good for when you need quick response and low, finite power.  This is why most eMTBs, Electric Mountain Bikes, use a Torque Sensor.  When you're on a single track trail, or going over very technical terrain, you want something that will respond quickly and accurately to your applied force.  A Torque Sensor is made for just this purpose.  It's also why some people will tell you it's more Natural Feeling to use a Torque sensor.  It's in these applications we highly recommend using or purchasing an E-bike that uses the Torque Sensor.  We've used Cadence sensors for this type of riding and though doable, it's more difficult and does require you to be more conscious of pedaling vs using the throttle. 

Another thing to consider about a Torque Sensor vs a Cadence sensor is are you riding at higher speeds?  As just mentioned, Torque Sensors are best used for slow, accurate riding.  As you approach speeds in the 28-30mph range, a Torque sensor drops to operating much like a Cadence sensor.  You'll even begin to notice some of that "Pedal Slack" we highlighted above.  This is because you can't pedal as fast without appropriate gearing, once you get to those upper speeds your torque matters less and how fast you're pedaling takes over.

You Talked Enough Now Tell Me, Which is Better? 

That is why you spent so much time reading this blog article, isn't it?  OK, well again, the answer isn't as simple as one is better than the other.  To get to it, if you intend to ride a lot of trails, out in the woods, desert or wherever, you probably want something with a Torque Sensor.  It will give you he finite control to ride smoothly through the more technical areas.  You're skill is still required, but it'll be easier than with a Cadence sensor E-bike.

That's not to say Cadence sensors don't have their place.  If you intend to ride more on the street, casually or off road, but more forged trail a Candence sensor will do just fine.  Additionally, this is the preference when your E-Bike has a Throttle.  Though you will find eMTBs with throttles and Torque Sensors, most other E-bikes go to using the Cadence sensor with throttles. 

Again, keep in mind, future maintenance.  A Candence sensor will cost about $80-$100 to replace full shop time, where a Torque Sensor can be hundreds of dollars to replace.  

Both sensors and their response level to your pedaling is adjustable, play around see what works for you.  So, which is better really depends on your preference of riding, ability to afford replacement and if you want to say you're E-bike uses the most expensive parts or if you're cool with getting around.

Notes From the Resident "Mad Scientist"

Ok, so now that you're read up, you know the differences, benefits and some of the draw backs, I'm going to tell you what I think about these things.  Torque Sensors, nice, but if you have a throttle or don't go out on really technical trails, kind of a pain in the ass.  It works great on the Pedal Assist Only E-bike we have here.  But, I like to go fast and ride hard, you get used to the way it helps in the lower speeds and when it starts slippin' and trippin' it's WAY more noticeable.  Like if you had a Ferrari and it got scratched.  WTF?!?!?!  Kind of the same feeling when you're blasting along and you get the pedal slip.  Almost "Racked" myself a couple of times on the seat when the pedal slip kicked in.

My personal preference is for Cadence Sensors.  Once adjusted and you get used to it, they are really nice.  I know I have to get one or two turns before mine kicks in.  How I have it set, it's smooth and not over whelming.  It was at first, almost fell off the bike.  With the Candence Sensor dialing it in is important.  Once you do though, you'll cruise along barely pedaling at 40+mph.  It's like you're on an exercise bike flying down the street.  Though it's, "Dummy Pedaling" I've found you still get a workout, heart rate elevates and you still have a lot of fun.  

I'd still want a Torque sensor on a mid-drive eMTB.  Especially if I was going out on some really rough or hilly areas, but I've been just fine with a properly dialed in Cadence sensor on the 8kw Thoroughbred.  What's you're thoughts on this highly debated question?

As discussed in our previous article, E-bikes and Voltage, Why It Matters, Voltage and AMPs have a relationship in how your e-bike motor works.  If Volts are related to your expected top speed, then AMPs are related to the Torque your electrical motor and system will produce.  Where Voltage could be visualized as the speed of an electrical flow, which would lead to it's relation to top speed, think of AMPs as the depth of the electrical flow.  Similar to a wave hitting a wall.  If the wave is small it doesn't do much, but if it's a large wall of water, it could have enough force to move or even destroy the wall.  We'll get to why that's important too.  This depth of flow has the ability to "push" the motor around, and that motion is then translated into you and your electric vehicle moving forward.  

Sure, I guess, but in a later article we'll talk about how Wattage is a good general rule of thumb, but not the best reference.  Voltage and AMPs are calculated together to come up with Wattage.  For example, you might have a motor that is connected to a 48v battery.  They are then connected to a controller that has a certain rated Amperage capability and all of this is connected by wires that also have a certain ability to carry Amperage.  For the example, let's say it's a smaller 500w rated motor.  There's a 20A capable controller(the electrical "brainbox") and it's all wired for 15A.  Don't freak out, it's normal to "under-wire" an electrical system so you don't overheat the components.  In this case we're all good, check it out below.

Here's the fun math part:

48v X 15A = 720w Peak Output

As you can see, the above wired system will be able to provide more than enough wattage to meet or exceed the draw capability of the motor @500w rating.  We can adjust the number of AMPs in the displays/controllers as well.  Most of the motors are made to exceed their rating for short periods.  That's why you may find some motors that say, they "go up to" the next level of motor wattage rating.  Like our 500w motor mentioned being able to handle the potential 720w we may push to it.  What most companies are doing when they say it goes "up to" is upping the AMPs in a burst or turbo mode to give you more usable wattage from the motor.  

Keeping all of the above in mind, it's important to understand how and with what gauge your e-bike, e-scooter or e-motorcycle is wired.  You can have high capacity, high output controllers and motors, but if you have them wired to low flow power wiring, you'll be choking them off from the performance you expect.   

It's also important to understand the relationship above because you will notice it when you're riding and your voltage drains.  With e-bikes, e-scooters, e-motorcycles and to some degree all electric vehicles, there's a range of Voltage at which the motors can operate.  Your new electric vehicle or micro-mobility might be full speed when you take off for the day with a full charge.  When you're on your way home, you might notice, it doesn't get all the way to the top speed it did earlier.  This is due to that range of voltage operation.  As your battery drains down, that formula above also gets smaller.  Where before your battery was putting our 48v@15A, by the end of your riding, it might only be pushing 40v@15A=600w.

Now that's still more than our example motor would be rated for, but you will notice the reduced performance as the motor is now getting a lower overall wattage.  

Across all of that voltage and wattage drop off, the one thing that remains constant is the Amperage available.  This does fluctuate with your specific need at the time, you might only use 5A-8A at a moment to maintain speed vs. the full 15A to accelerate from a dead stop, but the electrical system is always ready to give you 100% of the torque generated by the AMPs flow at all Voltages the motor and controller can operate under.  Translated from tech speak: You get all the available torque all the time, no matter what your electric vehicle voltage at the time.  

As an additional note, don't be confused over the AMPs a motor or controller can handle and the AMP capability of which the whole system is rated.  You could have a super duper motor and controller, being held back by limited wiring.  Ask what AMP flow or Ampacity the wiring has going to the components and how that matches up with the capabilities of the respective components.

Now, for most of you, that should be good.  You should be able to go out in the world and ask, "How many AMPs is my new e-bike capable of?" and actually know what the salesperson is telling you.  Or maybe you just stumped them.  Good for you!  

But, if you want to get in the mind of our resident "Mad Scientist" and Founder (I'm not actually a scientist and I've never played one on TV, why do you think me "mad"?) keep reading below.  

First I have to say, I'm not mad, maybe a little crazy, but I like to think we all are in our own way.  As long as that crazy doesn't hurt anyone, who cares if I have a wild head of poofy mad scientist hair and live in a castle on the hill.   I don't like in a castle on the hill, but the hair thing is true.  More so, I just look at things a little differently and that's the same here at E-Powersport.  Enough about me, let's talk about AMPs.  So you kept reading and want to get deeper on Amperage and what you need to look for in your next purchase.  Yes or No?  

Yes, good, let's climb in this rabbit hole......

We already gave you a lot to work with above, what more can I say?  Well, to start with, Gauges!  No not like the speedometer, but I like how you think.  The gauges of the wires being used as well as the connectors and battery BMS.  That right, to really get to the beginning in all this, we need to go directly to the power source, the freaking battery and BMS.  These are both rated at certain Ampacities.  They will normally have 2 ratings, one that is nominal or normal functioning AMP rating and one that's the MAX, normally expected for very short periods of time.  The wiring coming from the battery pack, is rated for a certain Ampacity and stated at its MAX AMP Rating, but wait, there's more....

The connector used to connect the battery pack to the motor has, what?  That's right, a certain Ampacity.  And so on and so on and so on, till we finally get to the motor that turns all the AMPs that finally made it into mechanical energy.    Woohoo!  Now go raise some heck with your new knowledge!  

Still there?  OK, what else can I say about AMPs and how freaking important it is to know the overall Ampacity of your e-bike, e-scooter, e-motorcycle or other electric vehicle?  From my perspective, Voltage and AMPs are a much better way to think about your new transportation's capabilities.  Wattage is a fluffy bunny # that doesn't mean much when you start adding things like weight into the equations or by that I mean real world use.  As we had shown above, those short burst can be as high as 50% increase in total power consumption.  Forget Wattage and Watt Hours, that's for home use.  On these, you want to focus on Voltage and how many AMPs are being delivered to the motor over what time period.  Are they giving you an AMP boost capability, like we talked about and how will that effect your distance, or are these nominally functional AMPs for a steady AMP flow?  Don't get me wrong, I think Wattage has it's place, but it's more about usage than a scaled rating.  

Another important aspect of AMPs and AMP flow is how that can relate to usage and distance.  As the AMP flow usage fluctuates it takes certain amounts of the Batteries Ampacity or as batteries are rated, Amp Hours or AH.  This could be used to calculate "time x amps used" to display remaining Amp Hours available in the battery pack.  There's already the ability to view Volts left in a battery on most e-bikes, e-scooters, e-motorcycles, but knowing how many AMPs are left for draw could be a more accurate indicator of time/miles left on a charge.  And I guess, you could always slap the two together and give a remaining wattage level of the battery.  But I think the more discerning or power user, will want to know the Volt/AMPs too.

Here's a crazy thing to think about:

1 Joule = 1W per Sec = 1NM (Newton Meter)

Do we really need three of the same metric?  What the What?!?!

When motors are measured for Wattage it's in hours.  Our previous 500w motor example would be expected to use 500w an hour, not per second.  Keep that in mind, now the Newton Meter is a normal measurement for Torque of an Electric Motor.  Most 500w motors are rated @60nm.  That means a 500w motor is using 60nm, or 60watts per second, or 60 joules to propel you at its top power usage.  Even crazier is there's no rated Watt.  A Watt is as Watt, but a Watt can be applied to a measurement of time, there hasn't been a standardization across the Electric Vehicle or other electric industries.  However, both a Joule and a NM have been set in ratings.  Speaking of wheels and ratings, one of my favorite teams to reference for knowledge are the team at GRIN Technologies in Canada.  Rather than reinvent what they've already defined in both a deeply technical and eloquent way, I'm going to provide a link to their related article here.  

They get so deep, I use their tools, just awesome stuff:

Futility of Motor Power Ratings

There's more we can cover, we could talk about how electricity doesn't actually flow in a wire, but is a wireless transmission being provided by a series of magnetic fields generated across the wire.  But we'll save that for later....

If you read our blog you know our previous stance on the mid-drive ebikes and using only Belt Drives.  Previous usage had shown us that Carbon Belt Drives are far superior to chains when it comes to mid-drive motors and getting the power to the wheel.  We even went as far as to find a manufacturer to work with on bringing these units to market.   We had a Spring 2022 launch scheduled.  That's correct, I said had, for you see, Christmas was not so merry for us this year.  Another company, Bikonit, beat us to the punch.  You may have seen their shameless "Youtuber Given an E-bike" marketing method.  But this isn't why we pulled bringing these to market.  It gets much more technical than that.

You see, before all of the recent events, we were lucky enough to meet and talk with Pushkar Phatak, CEO of Watt Wagons.  We actually met over their introduction of the Watt Wagons Helios and use of a belt drive.  We had a great discussion where he informed me that with the higher rates of torque today's motors produce a carbon belt drive gets eaten up.  I responded that the manufacturer I'm working with is confident and has been testing to make sure, which is why we're targeting a Spring release.  He wished me luck on it, but as it turns out, the luck was meeting him.

Back to this last week or so, I contacted the Manf and asked about this new company selling what appear to be the manf's bikes.  They explained they both use the same frames, but are different assembly plants and no affiliation.  They also informed me that after rigorous testing they will not be honoring our discussion about the belt drive units.  I was shocked, this could be a huge order but they insisted, it is not stable.  This made me question, well, this new company seems to have done it.  To which they replied, we will not sell a product we believe to be inferior.  We had to agree to work on chain drives with them as well as work on a future belt drive development.  So I had to then question, Bikonit.  Who is this company that has magically done what a large manufacturer has run from and what a smaller, high quality, boutique manufacturer has also told me won't work?

Yep, that's what I did, I put on my old corporate recruiter/research cap and went and researched Bikonit.  Wasn't hard, says right on their website, "We are a Brand company".  And to add to it, there's obvious copy and paste duplications and mistakes.  It looks like the whole business was slapped together in an evening.  But I digress, what should be of real concern to anyone here is that Bikonit, by their own admission is NOT a Bike, E-Bike or even a mobility company.  They are a brand.  They take a product like a pen someone else made and slap their name on it.  They market to you via celebrities to make you think you... Well, Macklemore said it best.  Now you can say I'm being salty, but I'm not.  I'm brining you information you should know before you go spend a few thousand $$$ of your hard earned cash or credit to get a bike that's going to break on you.     

I'm actually thankful that Bikonit came to market when it did, it caused me to ask the questions that brought to light the realities of using a belt drive on higher powered E-bikes and E-Motorcycles.  For the customer it should point out, that Yes, do your research, because it doesn't look like any of the Youtubers did before they made their videos about them or maybe they wouldn't have done them?  I know I'd rather put our name behind a product that's going to last.  Behind supporting companies that are looking to develop new technologies and use them to better our lives.  You can buy a "brand" E-bike if you want, we sell quality, electric transportation, if it has a "Brand" name on it, it's only because they're able to meet our standards.